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daellishou

Problems with SMS 10

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We have been using SMS 9.0 for a couple of years with SRH2D. We recently upgraded to 10.0. I am having a couple of major problems.

1. Program crashes when zoomed in in the map module and trying to move nodes (several times). I have been able to work around this.

2. Program crashes when converting a second group of polygons to mesh without deleting the mesh that was previously created.

We are working with a large model (over 40000 elements). We are now trying to expand the model slightly. In version 9.0 I was able to subdivide the scatter set to create the model. The full scatter set would use up all the memory. Whith our currently proposed model I have had to subdivide the scatter set into 5 parts. I am trying to create the mesh in each of the 5 areas. Can't get it to create the 2nd set without deleting the first.

Is there a different and better way to handle this in 10.0? I thought the memory management was supposed to be better in 10.0.

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Thank you for letting us know of these issues. If you have a set of files that can be used to reproduce the problems you describe, please contact Technical Support and send them your files. Tell them the files were requested by John Howlett. If you can also provide the steps to reproduce the crash, that will help us fix the issue.

Thank you,

John

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Sorry to hear of your troubles.

We aren't aware of problems with dragging nodes. If you can find a set of repeatable steps, please contact our technical support and give them a description of the steps so we can get this fixed.

There were a couple changes in SMS 10.0 that affect memory use. One change would give some savings to overall memory use was how we allocated storage. This gives some memory savings but the bigger effect was faster building of scattersets. If you are talking about switching from SMS 9.0 to SMS 10.0, you would also have the changes impacted by the development of SMS 9.2. I can't remember all of the details of the changes between these versions, but something along the way might have increased our memory use for some kinds of data.

Are you saying that in SMS 9.0, you could have the original scatter set and 5 sub-sets all in SMS at the same time?

What size of a scatterset are you working with?

Off the top of my head, I'm not sure that I have a definitive recommendation. You could try filtering your scatter set. If you use a small angle like 1 or 2 degrees, it will only remove points that really do not contribute much of anything to the shape of the surface. However, if you are running up against the memory limit performing the filter may itself cause you to exceed the memory limit.

In the next version of SMS, we plan to distribute a 64-bit version of our software which may help alleviate some problems like this. You will want a computer with lots of available RAM to work with large datasets in this version. The 64-bit version has pros and cons. It allows you to access far more memory with a single process, but the data storage mechanism requires more memory. We hope that this version will be released in beta sometime in the next month or two. Sorry that this is not an immediate help.

I would be interested to look at your data to try some things to see if I could come up with some more solid recommendations. Could you contact our technical support and get them your data? If that is possible, it would help us give you better guidance for your situation.

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Thanks for the quick response. Some clearification:

  1. I assume the scatter sets are the problem. The original dat is an ESRI 15-ft grid. I converted these to xyz point files. The point files (5) range in size from 77MB to 133MB (I have no idea about the number of points). Thats why I subdivided and maybe I need to further subdivide. The h5 files ranged from 95-165MB.
  2. In 9.0 I was able to get by with subdividing the scatter data into 2 areas. I think I resampled the grid to a 45' grid for the previous work. I am trying to convert the grid to a TIN and then go to a point file. This would give much better results that just dropping out the data by resampling the grid. However, this also takes a long tin to make this conversion.
  3. I will try to reduce the scatter set sizes and if I am still having problem I will forward copies of the files to Technical Support.
  4. I am looking forward to the 64 bit version because of the large data sets we are working with. The processing speed of the SMS program is not a problem at 32 bit. However, I will continue to try to work around the problem because the projects won't wait.
  5. Will SMS read or import an ESRI TIN?

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If you get the scatter set into SMS, you can go to File | Get Info to see how many vertices/triangles your problem has.

SMS 10.0 cannot import ESRI tins. The next version of SMS (10.1) will be able to read in 3D shapefiles with polygons as TIN faces. Using ESRI's tools you can convert a TIN to a 3D shapefile.

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I think I found a solution. I just had to quit trying to work with the large scatter files. I created a mesh with a constant elevation. Using the nodes locations from the 2DM file I was able to develop a point file with a point for each mesh node (about 36,000 nodels). Using ArcGIS I was able to interpolate or add an elevation value for each point. I used this point file to create a scatter set and interpolated to the mesh. The results look OK but if I make significant changes to the mesh file I may need to go through that process again. SMS 10.0 handles the mesh and scatter set with no obvious problem. Thanks for your quick response.

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Thanks for the update. I recently noticed that if I read in a scatter set from an ASCII file throught the import wizard and uncheck the box to triangulate, I am able to read in larger scatter sets. Once the scatter set is read in I can triangulate it. I am looking into why this happens and hope to have a fix in the next update of SMS.

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Just as an update - we rewrote some of the code in SMS to reduce the amount of memory used while reading in large scatter sets. You should now be able to read in large scatter sets and still check the triangulate button.

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Just as an update - we rewrote some of the code in SMS to reduce the amount of memory used while reading in large scatter sets. You should now be able to read in large scatter sets and still check the triangulate button.

Will we have to wait for the next release, or will this updated code be released as a software update sometime soon? I too am having trouble with importing large sets. Are you aware of the upper limit for number of points that can be imported with the import wizard without an error?

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Chris,

This change is available in SMS 10.0 and 10.1 Beta. I don't have specific numbers for the upper limit, but it will depend on how much RAM SMS is using for other things you have read in (feature objects, grid, etc.) and which version of SMS you are using (32 vs. 64 bit). The 64 bit version of SMS will be able to read in larger scatter sets.

Have you tried using any of the filtering options (Step 2 of the import wizard - "Filter Options" button)? It looks like the filtering is only working in SMS 10.0 at the moment. I'll report the problem in SMS 10.1 Beta.

Once you've read in the scatter data, you can try using the normals filtering to make the scatter set a more manageable size.

How large is the scatter set you are working with?

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I have also had problems with mysterious crashing. SMS just freezes and I have to reboot whole computer. This seems to happen randomly and with even smallest files. Currently using version 10.0, I should have the 10.1, but I have not been able to register it. Sometimes this crashing also corrupts the nmodel files.

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Sorry to hear of your troubles. Could you be more specific about the problem you are having registering 10.1? Have you been in contact with Technical Support trying to resolve them?

I have also had problems with mysterious crashing. SMS just freezes and I have to reboot whole computer. This seems to happen randomly and with even smallest files. Currently using version 10.0, I should have the 10.1, but I have not been able to register it. Sometimes this crashing also corrupts the nmodel files.

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I have a hardware lock for 10.0. I tried to update the installation, but for some reason the update did not run. Then I installed a fresh version, but it doesn't recognize the hardware lock.

Sorry to hear of your troubles. Could you be more specific about the problem you are having registering 10.1? Have you been in contact with Technical Support trying to resolve them?

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SMS updates are only for fixes within a SMS version such as SMS 10.0 or SMS 10.1 rather than moving from SMS 10.0 to SMS 10.1. A hardware lock for SMS 10.0 will not work with SMS 10.1 until you reburn the lock. If you are up to date on maintenance, you can get a code that can convert your SMS 10.0 hardware lock to SMS 10.1. Please contact sales@aquaveo.com and they can get this setup.

I have a hardware lock for 10.0. I tried to update the installation, but for some reason the update did not run. Then I installed a fresh version, but it doesn't recognize the hardware lock.

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Thank you Rusty. I will contact sales.

SMS updates are only for fixes within a SMS version such as SMS 10.0 or SMS 10.1 rather than moving from SMS 10.0 to SMS 10.1. A hardware lock for SMS 10.0 will not work with SMS 10.1 until you reburn the lock. If you are up to date on maintenance, you can get a code that can convert your SMS 10.0 hardware lock to SMS 10.1. Please contact sales@aquaveo.com and they can get this setup.

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